One thing fun about the seo business is, anyone can put their horrible picture up on a website and call themselves an expert. We were notified of a guy and his minions that chose to make a few shots at us. At first, we were going to send a simple email to Doug Heil and request that he remove the libel material from his site, but we did a little research and began to see the real story about this guy and his tactics.

We did a search for his company name, and the negative remarks about him being a spammer and problem maker, go on and on. It was at this point we realized they have about as much credit as a street hustler living in a cardboard box. The many sites we found that spoke of him and his minions seemed to follow a similar pattern; they call names and lose more and more credibility. It seems this guy’s sole purpose in life is to flame other individuals and other companies. “Why?” We have no idea, other than possible jealousy, greed, attention or maybe he really thinks he is an expert. It is obvious this guy practices what he preaches … he is a spammer. A great comparison that comes to mind is, take a relationship where a girl is extremely jealous of everything her guy does. . .it is 99% of the time due to the fact she has been the guilty one.

The actual individual that fought for us over there is the one that informed us of the find, contrary to their poor investigative work. A city of several million, one in which we reside and do a large part of business in, yet we are the only one’s in it. 😀 Anyhow, that person found some great reading material to crush any credibility they thought they might have had and it only made sense to include it here with some descriptive anchor tags:

Doug Heil Wanker

or if I should call my attorney. There’s a bit of an entertainment factor involved with being the only person singled out by name.I just wish Doug would tell the truth. Everytime he gets on his “SES and Spammers” rant, he always fails to mention the fact that he was once given an opportunity to speak at SES. The end result was a bad vaudeville act accept we couldn’t find any rotten fruit to throw at him. I’ve never seen so many people stand up and walk out while someone was speaking. I’ve also never heard of a speaker getting a rating of zero before. When everything was said and done, he was never asked back because none of the paying attendees wanted to hear what he has to say.The other point of his rant that is completely absurd is the idea that the “Notorius SES Spammers” are the same people that take on clients and engage in black tactics whitout the clients being aware. That is utter bullshit. (The companies that do that can usually be found in the exhibit hall, not on the speakers podium).

99.99% of black work that has been done by anyone willing to speak about it in public is done on their own personal sites. We’ve all spent time doing pharmaceuticals, debt consolidation, gambling, sbobet mobile games, mortgages, etc. but that work in no way has any bearing on how we apprroach a mainstream client. And it also has absolutely zero impact on whether or not a mainstream client decides to hire us. If anything, they are less apprehensive because they know exactly where we stand because we are willing to answer whatever questions they want to ask honestly.

 

WebGuerrila

I think you are more inclined to contact a lawyer about that.You are 100% correct, there is a huge difference in how you handle a corporate client and how you handle your own domains. I’ve done some bad things on my sites that I wouldn’t even mention to an actual client. Some of the best whitehat SEOs I’ve ever seen have extensive knowledge in blackhat tactics.

I would consider that libel, by labeling you a spammer and someone who should not go near a client. I personally would hate to see my name show up in the SERPs someday in a thread like that. Then again, consider the source. A bunch of guys who are so talented at “whitehat SEO” that they are crying about the price of a plane ticket to a show.

By thePhenomenal at Thu, 2005-08-18 14:15 | reply | write to author | top

I’m not sure if I should be flattered,

or if I should call my attorney. There’s a bit of an entertainment factor involved with being the only person singled out by name.

I just wish Doug would tell the truth. Everytime he gets on his “SES and Spammers” rant, he always fails to mention the fact that he was once given an opportunity to speak at SES. The end result was a bad vaudeville act accept we couldn’t find any rotten fruit to throw at him.

I’ve never seen so many people stand up and walk out while someone was speaking. I’ve also never heard of a speaker getting a rating of zero before. When everything was said and done, he was never asked back because none of the paying attendees wanted to hear what he has to say.

The other point of his rant that is completely absurd is the idea that the “Notorius SES Spammers” are the same people that take on clients and engage in black tactics whitout the clients being aware. That is utter bullshit. (The companies that do that can usually be found in the exhibit hall, not on the speakers podium).

99.99% of black work that has been done by anyone willing to speak about it in public is done on their own personal sites. We’ve all spent time doing pharmaceuticals, debt consolidation, gambling, mortgages, etc. but that work in no way has any bearing on how we apprroach a mainstream client. And it also has absolutely zero impact on whether or not a mainstream client decides to hire us. If anything, they are less apprehensive because they know exactly where we stand because we are willing to answer whatever questions they want to ask honestly.

By WebGuerrilla at Thu, 2005-08-18 13:49 | reply | top

ihelpyou,inc – spammer

Yep

I got to see the fight, and managed to save a copy of danny’s response. Here’s a couple of choice snippets:Doug

Besides, Danny Sullivan just told me that if I posted this “in public” in here, he would ban me for good at the SEW forums. Go for it Danny! Be my guest.

That place is a sham and a shame. They only want people who can agree with spammers and “get along” with spammers. Not a community that’s good for “our” industry in any way, shape, or form.

It’s a sad story when we see our industry being run and used by a bunch of people who condone and “teach” and “celebrate” spammers. I am actually ashamed to be a part of this industry.

Jupiter will go down one day. I’ll be laughing my arse off when they do.

He rants and raves for quite a bit longer but it’s just much of the same…

Danny

quote:
I’m done with them.

You were apparently done with us nearly 300 posts ago. As a reminder, this is what you said when you swooped into our community with your very first post:

quote:
This is my last post in this place.

That was a grand entrance into a community you’d never been part of before. Sort of like kicking a door down, saying I’m here, you all suck, and I’m never coming back. But you did keep coming back, and you were welcomed to as long as you could follow basic rules of behavior. But as explained in my email to you on being premoderated, you didn’t.

I wouldn’t normally discuss this at all, but since you want to make it a public matter on your own board, I’ll spend a few minutes telling my side. Then you can ban me or delete me or just leave the post up as you decide.

Let’s share the post that finally made me decide that — after you’d been warned previously not to flame or be rude to other community members — that you needed to be premoderated.

quote:

Massa; Shut up.

No one listens to you. You flame me. I flame you. We are even.

Very nice, if we were on a kindergarten playground. You hit me; I hit you. It’s not a playground. We want people to respect each other — and as you had been previously told, if you feel others are flaming you, ask a moderator to help. Don’t get into a fight.

You feel upset that the post still counted even though you yourself deleted it? Perhaps you might have followed up with me or Elisabeth on that issue privately. You didn’t do that at all, which makes me think the intent was never really about being able to actually participate in our community.

Instead, you decided you had to go and do a post about how we’ve terribly wronged you. As promised, that’s now resulted in you being banned on our forum. You run a forum, Doug. It’s not easy — well, for you it is perhaps, if you ban people right and left. We don’t. I think we have three or four people banned and one or two on premoderation. By and large, we work to help everyone get along. Someone recently called our board the “Geneva” of search marketing forums, and I loved that. I think the industry could use a Geneva or two.

If you make a decision that you ultimately think is in the best interest of your forum, I think you’d want someone in your community to either respect that or leave. That’s what I told you in my email to you:

quote:
As said, you are on premoderated status. You can post, if those posts are approved. You can live with that decision, and it may be lifted in the future, if Elisabeth feels it is warranted.

If you dislike the decision and feel you need to squawk in whatever “big way” you seem to have in mind, that’s your choice. But if you do so, you won’t be welcome to post here anymore. We’ll simply move you to banned status. The decision was made for a good reason. You can live with it or leave. Being threating isn’t going to change that. Better behavior will.

Apparently, better behavior — after a long history of being warned — wasn’t an option for you. So, you aren’t an option for us.

quote:
Spammers are put above everyone else. I guess it’s because of the “money” they give to Jupiter Media? Money drives greed. Those of us who would never give Jupiter one dime are out of the picture.

Spammers are not put about all else on our forum. Your characterization of our forums in that way is insulting and perhaps even slanderous. The fact that you personally do not want people to discuss things does not mean that others shouldn’t be allowed to do so, nor that there should be usefulness in that, nor that doing so is telling the world to spam, nor that money is being spent to somehow shield “spammers” from talking to the greater world.

We’ve had this discussion before, of course. People can find us doing the back-and-forth here or on our own forum. So I’m not going to get into it again. You have your position; you’re locked to it, and that’s that, I guess.

quote:
So go ahead and threaten me with a ban Danny. See if I truly care what you do. lol Watch me “shake in my shoes.”

As for being threatening, I think you need to spin that mirror around. When you got in touch, let’s remember what you said:

quote:

I want to know exactly why I cannot post anymore? or being “moderated” or something?

If this is indeed the case, you all will hear and see this “in public” in a big way.

Was I supposed to scurry back and worry that because you might be upset, I shouldn’t premoderate you but instead have you continue to perhaps flame people in a way you’d been warned not to before? Were you expecting that you should get some type of “Flame & Get Out Of Jail Free” card? I’m not going to do that for anyone that I think is harmful to the community, sorry.

 

ihelpyou,inc spams

The SEO Fundamentalists Speak Out:
The fact that Nandini’s about 2 month old SEO forums just showed me over 10,000 pages listed in Google and get most of its inbound link popularity from WebAtlas (while linking back to WebAtlas from most of its pages) would indicate to me that this issue is probably a technical glitch, but some SEOs use these sorts of situations as marketing goldmines to promote their own holier than thouTM SEO beliefs.

Ihelpyou forums moderators showed their truely nasty selves when they wrote digraceful threads on multiple SEO forums.

I’ve read that IHU thread. It’s nothing short of a vicious, malicious, personal attack by a bunch of low life cowards who delight in other peoples misfortune.

With one or two notable exceptions, the thread is populated by the scum of the web community – a poor bunch of outcasts that can find no better place for their whining self justification for poor skillsets than the deranged chuch of heil. Nick W

Lets not forget that this is the same IHY group that was falling all over themselves stating that Nandini and WebAtlas were great just two months ago. Doug even requested a link to his forums.

Of course Doug would not like to be reminded of these types of things, and some of his moderators such as Srikanth state:

none of the members at ihelpyouforums are trying to abuse her. Or, are not against her. We wish her success only.

You do not support a persons work by throwing arbitrary tags on it.

Legitimate Directories:
Doug Heil posted a short list of legitimate directories apparently based upon who frequently posts at his forums. The now good directories include WowDirectory, which Doug Heil also accused of being a spammer in the past.